(0:00 – 0:16)
Hello, everyone. I’m Dr. Michael Mantell, along with Bonnie Rabinovitch-Mantel, owner and managing partner of the Primus Family Law Group. We’re a family-oriented firm where experience meets results.

(0:16 – 0:33)
I understand that today the tables are turning, Bonnie. I am so excited. For once, I get to ask you a couple of questions because we in this field have been dealing with a lot of people who have emotional questions.

(0:33 – 0:49)
So as you know, and we said it a lot, divorce is the hardest thing people are gonna go through. It is essentially, right, Michael, the breakup of a family. And we see clients in all stages of emotional distress.

(0:49 – 1:05)
So maybe you can explain to our viewers what exactly happens when this kind of devastation occurs. Well, that’s a great question. And since we have several hours, we can, oh, I guess we don’t have several hours.

(1:05 – 1:17)
Let me cut to it, which I call my coaching. Cut to it coaching, okay. Divorce is a physical separation and it’s an emotional separation.

(1:17 – 1:43)
It tears at the heart. In fact, if not handled properly, it can literally tear at the heart and cause physical illness. And one of the issues that’s involved is grief, grieving over the loss of dreams, grieving over the loss of family, grieving over the loss of love, grieving over the loss of a planned life.

(1:43 – 1:59)
And that’s normal. And so many years ago, a woman named Cougar Ross developed something that she called the five stages of grief. And they are simply denial, anger, bargaining, depression, and acceptance.

(1:59 – 2:07)
Let me take you through them real quickly. Nobody goes through these stages, by the way, one after another after another. Okay, I’ve gone through the five.

(2:07 – 2:13)
It is a process. Three steps forward, two steps back. The first is denial.

(2:13 – 2:20)
No, I cannot believe this is happening. I don’t accept this reality. It’s a defense mechanism.

(2:20 – 2:35)
And people do not necessarily do this because they actually think, no, it’s not happening, but they’re protecting themselves. So we call this denial. The second is anger.

(2:35 – 2:46)
When that denial, that psychological novocaine wears off, anger comes forward. And that’s where you see a lot of people popping into your office. Emotions run really high.

(2:47 – 3:02)
And after they have suppressed these emotions, pretended psychologically they don’t exist, then people channel these emotions into hatred and blame. And that’s the anger stage. And then you have the bargaining.

(3:02 – 3:18)
Well, and they may tell you, Bonnie, I’m thinking maybe if I go back, try it again, maybe she or he or they will be different. Maybe if I act differently, maybe we can come to a different agreement and we can treat each other differently. It’s not gonna work.

(3:18 – 3:29)
They know it’s not gonna work, but they feel they have to go through this. Now, when that fails, they go into a depression. The reality of the situation sets in.

(3:29 – 3:49)
This is the toughest and often the longest stage. And this is where myself and people like me from my professional background get called in to be of help. Finally, after time, this is usually after the divorce has gone through, after people have lived with this for 11 months, 12 months, they come to acceptance.

(3:49 – 4:05)
When you make peace with the situation and you find hope in the future, people start to feel like their old selves again. They start to think about dating again, about they entertain the prospect of creating a new family again. And they see the light at the end of the tunnel.

(4:05 – 4:21)
And it’s important to remember that grief comes in waves. It’s not a linear journey. So those are the five stages of grief, denial, anger, bargaining, depression, and acceptance, common as can be.

(4:21 – 4:51)
And you as a family law attorney see people in each of these stages. And I will tell you that sometimes depending on what stage they’re in, it affects their ability or their, well, their ability to see the path forward, their ability to help their attorney get them through the process. And my, you know, we find ourselves saying often, we are not your therapist, right? As attorneys, our focus is getting through the legal process.

(4:51 – 5:13)
We have discussed before that we often say, if you need, you know, please get a therapist, please find a life coach that can help you through these processes. Because if they’re managing their emotions, then they’re going to be able to manage their divorce. Kids go through this same set of stages as well, right? Absolutely.

(5:13 – 5:31)
And kids suffer because of the psychological impairment of their parents and of their parents’ parents. The way their grandparents treat their parents floats down to the child as well. And that’s why these are the kinds of cases that we deal with.

(5:32 – 5:38)
And the people- Parents don’t go through it the same way that kids go through it. Absolutely not. No.

(5:38 – 6:26)
And so would you say it’s important for parents and children to talk about these stages while they’re going through the divorce to help each other get through it? Yes. I wouldn’t necessarily say you have to use these terms of denial and, you know, you don’t need those terms, but to talk about how each is feeling, asking open-ended questions, not closed questions. For example, you don’t say to a child, are you angry? But rather, how are you feeling today? What kinds of thoughts are you having today? The difficulty is when one parent asks a child, sometimes that’s meant to point the child in an angry way towards the other parent.

(6:26 – 6:37)
It’s manipulative questioning. It’s not an honest interest in how that child is experiencing the process. So that’s where coaching and therapy sometimes is very, very necessary.

(6:38 – 6:59)
And I urge people to understand that that may be a part of getting help. This is a very emotionally disturbing upheaval and people need help at those times. So seek out professional help when you wonder, maybe my kid needs some help.

(6:59 – 7:02)
Maybe I need some help. Get it. Absolutely.

(7:02 – 7:24)
So if people, because you know how much Primus respects Michael Mantel and the work that you do helping so many people get through so many things. So how can our listeners reach out to you? I have a very personalized practice and a very personalized approach. If people wanna be in touch with me, call me on my cell phone.

(7:27 – 7:35)
619-743-2555. 619-743-2555. Text me.

(7:35 – 7:52)
And if people wanna write to me, you can write to me at my email address. Dr. Mantel, Dr. Mantel, Dr. Mantel with two L’s at me.com. They can reach me there. Or you can call Primus Family Law and you’ll put people in touch with me.

(7:52 – 8:11)
Absolutely. I was just gonna say that. And if you wanna reach out to us so that we can direct you to Michael, it is 619-574-8000 or www.PrimusFamilyLaw.com. And you offer a 30-minute free consultation, don’t you, Bonnie? I do.

(8:11 – 8:21)
And you can reach us for that as well. And we will get you on our calendar to schedule it with me and see how we can best help you with your family law matter. Bonnie, it’s great to talk with you.

(8:21 – 8:24)
Thanks for flipping the tables today. We’ll see you next time. I like it.

(8:25 – 8:31)
Next time, sure you do. We’ll see you next time for another Family Law Matters. Have a great day.