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Hi everyone, I’m Dr. Michael Mantell with another Family Law Matters. Privileged to be joining Bonnie Rabinovitch Mantel who is the owner and managing partner of the Primus Family Law Group. Hi Bonnie.

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Hi Michael. Every time you say that, I’m so surprised that I do this, that I can help these people. Every time you introduce me that way.

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Thank you Michael. We go back to when we were little kids and we didn’t think we could do anything. And here we are grownups doing it, going like, wow, I guess I can do it.

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But one of the, family law is not so simple. It is not just like two people breaking up. Okay, bye.

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It’s rather complicated. There’s a topic that we’ve bumped into which has to do with retirement accounts when people divorce. And this goes beyond my head.

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So we need to have you bring it back down to reality and make it understandable. Mr. and Mrs. Jones have been married for 35 years and now they’re gonna get a divorce, the gray divorce. And Mr. Jones has retired a year or so ago.

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Let’s not complicate it, hasn’t retired yet. Hasn’t retired yet, he’s still working. Good for him.

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They get divorced. Where does the retirement issue and how Mrs. Jones gets a piece of Mr. Jones’ retirement get into this? Well, Michael, I know it is very complicated and you’re right. Getting divorced is not just, it’s not always about the kids and the property.

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There’s other stuff that involves math and complicated formulas and it can be very, very daunting. But to make it understandable, you and your spouse are two halves of one whole. So everything that you’ve done together or as a community during the marriage, your work, your efforts, your retirement, your accounts, your cars, it doesn’t matter whose name you put it in unless you had a specific writing, something else.

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It’s all community property, which means your spouse gets 50%, half of your retirement. Now, the only thing, Michael, is if you started your retirement before you were married, you’re gonna keep that piece as your separate property. And whatever that piece grew in the market, that’s gonna be your separate property.

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Everything else is community, halvesies. It’s pretty simple when you put it that way, right? That is understandable. Now, it only becomes more complicated when people are married for less time.

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Usually when you’re married 35 years, it’s more likely it’s all one big pot together. And so that’s actually easier because everybody gets half. It’s when you’ve been married seven years.

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And so then we have to involve that math and involve other experts that help us on a regular basis to make sure we are dividing only what’s been earned during the marriage. And that goes on for how long? How long do I benefit from my previous spouse’s retirement? Well, that really depends what kind of retirement you have. So if you have a 401k, which we know is pretty much a savings account, right? You can figure out you have $200,000 in that 401k.

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And let’s say your wife is entitled, or your spouse is entitled to half. So she gets 100,000. Well, you also know if you pull that money out, you’re gonna pay taxes on that.

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So what we do is we make sure it is rolled over, transferred, her share, his share, is transferred into her 401k account so that there are no tax complications or implications. But if you have a pension, Dr. Mantel, in that case, we determine what is the piece of the pension that belongs to the spouse. And every month that amount is given to her, either by you or from the plan, every month.

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Amazing. So Bonnie, this is not so simple. You explain it clearly as you can easily do.

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When people have more questions about this, and people may not even be aware that this is an issue. So when the people hear this and say, you know, I never thought about this, I wanna call Bonnie Mantel at Primus Family Law. How can they be in touch with you to get more information about this? Well, they can reach me directly at 619-574-8000, and you will be put on my calendar for a free 30 minute telephone or Zoom consultation.

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Or you can reach us online at www.PrimusFamilyLaw.com. There’s a live chat agent you can speak to and they’ll connect you directly. Or you can fill out a form and we will reach back out to you.